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To Believe or not to. (Be). That is the question
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E-mailMade Popular Oct 11 2008
France :
This article is a big thank-you for all the inspiring comments on my last article (Meditation time, girls and boys). Those comments were gentle and moving, friendly and generous. More importantly though, they have provoked a lot of thought in me. And two questions. “Why and how are people religious? and “Why aren’t I”. I can’t answer the first, obviously, but the answer to the second is below. Thank you all.
___________________________________
How not to be Religious in One Easy Lesson
First, like me, you go to church every week until you’re 13 years old. Then, like me, you lose your parents. Then, as is normal, you walk into a church 2 days after to pray for them...
...You are the only person in the church, because it’s three o’clock in the afternoon. You go to the second row from the front (it’s easier to see the statue of Mary), kneel down, and begin thinking and meditating and praying, or a mixture of all three or whatever. You do what you can because you’re just a child, and children aren’t supposed to be experts at THAT kind of prayer. You are aware of this but you continue, slightly embarrassed, and hope god will hear and understand you anyway.
After a few minutes, just when you’re getting used to it, you hear heavy footsteps coming down the aisle towards you. They stop, and you feel the person’s presence near you, so you turn around and look up.
A priest is there, looming above you, dressed in a black robe, with a shiny white collar. He’s looking straight into your eyes. He says
“What are you doing here?”. You answer
“I’m praying”.
He says “What are you praying for?”
And you answer “I’m praying for my parents”.
Then he gets angry and his face goes red and he says “Of course you are, just like all the other kids who come to church in the afternoon. You’re here to steal. Get out of here now and go and steal silverware and money somewhere else”.
You look up at him. There’s a moment’s silence. Then, slowly and unsteadily, because that really shook you up, you don’t say a word as you walk back up the long aisle towards the big church doors and you don’t look back and you get to the doors and you walk through them and out of the church and into the tepid warmth of a January day into the blinding sunlight which hurts your eyes but you like it because it’s light and you’re in light and you feel better and you wonder why all that happened and why he didn’t believe you because he’s a priest after all and you’re only a boy after all and it’s all so confusing and you keep on walking away............
.........I have never set foot in a church since that day.
Michael C
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i almost forgot
the title to your post is
whatelse
but
POETIC!
the title to your post is
whatelse
but
POETIC!
(Global Perspectives)
Nah! It’s just that I have forgotten my Shakespeare!!!lol
(Local Perspectives)
Shahwar, I was almost dreading your reaction to this article lol!!
You know what, you’re right, of course. I’ve always described myself as a kind of ”spiritually independant” man. I don’t subscribe to any kind of organised religion, of course, but, and you may be certain of this my friend, I have a very developed sense of my spiritual existence. I’ve known this all my life.
Being on the outer edges of the spiritual ”mission” to quote Oscar, can be a kind of lonely place sometimes. But that’s the price I have to pay for the ”privilege”.
God is there, I know, it’s just that I don’t yet have a communication device like ”prayer” or ”meditation” with which to dialogue. I will find that though. That’s the reason for my existence.......
(Oh, and thanks for the ”poet of prose”, but you are more. You are a poet. A real one..............quite simply)
You know what, you’re right, of course. I’ve always described myself as a kind of ”spiritually independant” man. I don’t subscribe to any kind of organised religion, of course, but, and you may be certain of this my friend, I have a very developed sense of my spiritual existence. I’ve known this all my life.
Being on the outer edges of the spiritual ”mission” to quote Oscar, can be a kind of lonely place sometimes. But that’s the price I have to pay for the ”privilege”.
God is there, I know, it’s just that I don’t yet have a communication device like ”prayer” or ”meditation” with which to dialogue. I will find that though. That’s the reason for my existence.......
(Oh, and thanks for the ”poet of prose”, but you are more. You are a poet. A real one..............quite simply)
(Local Perspectives)
”I have a very developed sense of my spiritual existence.”
that’s it!
there you are!
GOOD!
God made you and me and all!
you just need to know and acknowledge that!
the rest...communication...
is your call!
thanks!
that’s it!
there you are!
GOOD!
God made you and me and all!
you just need to know and acknowledge that!
the rest...communication...
is your call!
thanks!
(Global Perspectives)
”The communication....is your call”. Whether you meant the play on words or not, (and one can never be sure with you, lol) you’ve hit the nail right on the head......
(Local Perspectives)
play with words!
”God made you and me and all!
you just need to know and acknowledge that!
the rest...communication...
is your call!”
that kinda rhymes!
accidental though!
guess that’s what happens when i get a good post to comment upon!
”God made you and me and all!
you just need to know and acknowledge that!
the rest...communication...
is your call!”
that kinda rhymes!
accidental though!
guess that’s what happens when i get a good post to comment upon!
(Global Perspectives)
Thank you, Shahwarrior, the Word Player par Excellence.
(Local Perspectives)
I think the best part of life is the mission...I actually prefer not knowing as it allows me to continue searching.. If you BELEIVE that’s all that matters. I don’t know if it’s GOD, BUDDAH, ALA, or the MAN in the MOON running this gig, but someone or something much larger than you or I is working the world and everything we know.....
Although I was raised Catholic and still hold beliefs, I have taken in many others as well...Maybe it’s not right, but I take a little from here and a little from there, hold the good in my heart, mind, and living..and move on..searching for more golden truths to add to my collection of goods..
I want to beleive..not conform. God is NOT religion and religion is NOT God..
keep walking Michael..continue searching, make it your mission..but do not deny the truths you find..carry them with you and hold on to them dearly...THIS IS OUR RELIGION...this is what we believe...it puts us one step closer to God, a God, OR all 300 Gods, ..but it also keeps us beleiving in ourselves and HUMANITY.
Peace
Although I was raised Catholic and still hold beliefs, I have taken in many others as well...Maybe it’s not right, but I take a little from here and a little from there, hold the good in my heart, mind, and living..and move on..searching for more golden truths to add to my collection of goods..
I want to beleive..not conform. God is NOT religion and religion is NOT God..
keep walking Michael..continue searching, make it your mission..but do not deny the truths you find..carry them with you and hold on to them dearly...THIS IS OUR RELIGION...this is what we believe...it puts us one step closer to God, a God, OR all 300 Gods, ..but it also keeps us beleiving in ourselves and HUMANITY.
Peace
(Global Perspectives)
I don’t yet have a communication device like ”prayer” or ”meditation” with which to dialogue.
Michael... You’re wrong my friend.. I can see it and sense your kind in your words..You’ve been doing it all along, you just didn’t know it..Think about it, now think about yourself..Give up?
(your)ACTIONS speak louder than(any) WORDS.........including prayer.
Michael... You’re wrong my friend.. I can see it and sense your kind in your words..You’ve been doing it all along, you just didn’t know it..Think about it, now think about yourself..Give up?
(your)ACTIONS speak louder than(any) WORDS.........including prayer.
(Global Perspectives)
”I think the best part of life is the mission”.
Oscar, your comment (I mean all of it, not just the quote above) is superb. There’s nothing I can say about it. It’s just wonderful to be able to read it.................quite simply.
Michael
Oscar, your comment (I mean all of it, not just the quote above) is superb. There’s nothing I can say about it. It’s just wonderful to be able to read it.................quite simply.
Michael
(Local Perspectives)
I need to thank you Michael..Your actions, bring us all together..to express, to share, to teach, and to learn...we’re all here for the good of you, one another, and ourselves..
Look at the sheer beauty running ”violently out of control” on your post...People like you, Shahwar, Ramesh and many othrs have a true purpose. You open door which have never been locked, but forgotten..I have never been let down when showing up at one of these doors which you’ve provided..for beyond each one you shone light on another path not to God, but to true humanity..
If you could see me...You’d see a nameless Mexican in a big nameless town
saluting and thanking you all.. and being reminded of the joy and wonders of Life and Believing..
Look at the sheer beauty running ”violently out of control” on your post...People like you, Shahwar, Ramesh and many othrs have a true purpose. You open door which have never been locked, but forgotten..I have never been let down when showing up at one of these doors which you’ve provided..for beyond each one you shone light on another path not to God, but to true humanity..
If you could see me...You’d see a nameless Mexican in a big nameless town
saluting and thanking you all.. and being reminded of the joy and wonders of Life and Believing..
(Global Perspectives)
@ Oscar!
Thanks!
Shukriya!
you know humans can convey and more through words, words which are not always spoken, but felt!
some people have the miracle to write unspoken words...
and Sir, you sure are one of them!
It sure is a pleasure, being here at Insta...where everyone has a viewpoint...
WHERE EVERYONE HAS A HEART!
Thanks!
Shukriya!
you know humans can convey and more through words, words which are not always spoken, but felt!
some people have the miracle to write unspoken words...
and Sir, you sure are one of them!
It sure is a pleasure, being here at Insta...where everyone has a viewpoint...
WHERE EVERYONE HAS A HEART!
(Global Perspectives)
Grown ups especially those occupying some social positions tend to forget the real human emotions and they tar the whole group with the same brush.If you acknowledge the existence of the Supreme Being just by doing what he has sent you to do in the first place I personally feel it is as good as being a regular church goer.
(Global Perspectives)
I couldn’t agree more Veena. Sometimes it’s hard to know exactly what we are supposed to ”do”, but then again, no-one ever said it was supposed to be easy.
As far as being a regular churchgoer is concerned, my life has taught me that that’s what I’m NOT supposed to do, so I just go with it and try to find out about my spiritual potential via other means. (This is in no way intended to denigrate churchgoers).
Thank you for your kind words...
As far as being a regular churchgoer is concerned, my life has taught me that that’s what I’m NOT supposed to do, so I just go with it and try to find out about my spiritual potential via other means. (This is in no way intended to denigrate churchgoers).
Thank you for your kind words...
(Local Perspectives)
Hey Michael,
That was a sad story, which fully explains the way you feel about religion. I guess we all suffer from people assigned in wrong positions who represent different concepts wrongly, in your case the priest wrongly representing religion.
I truly believe religion is something that you find inside your self rather than through people. I hope you find the right thing deep down :)
That was a sad story, which fully explains the way you feel about religion. I guess we all suffer from people assigned in wrong positions who represent different concepts wrongly, in your case the priest wrongly representing religion.
I truly believe religion is something that you find inside your self rather than through people. I hope you find the right thing deep down :)
(Global Perspectives)
It is ”deep down”, as you say, but I’ll find it. I have to. So I will. But Wa’d, ironically enough as it may seem, I’ll find it through people. Just ordinary people.........
Your comment is very intriguing.....
Thank you.
Your comment is very intriguing.....
Thank you.
(Local Perspectives)
By the end of the day, if you manage to find it through people then that would be great... I find dealing with people for such things a hard task to carry out, but I guess everyone have their own different experiences and preferences.
So...Best of luck with your searching journey :)
So...Best of luck with your searching journey :)
(Global Perspectives)
I never quite found out why I lost my faith..I find comfort in the fact that you know it so well.
(Global Perspectives)
Hi Sarah!
I never thought of looking at things that way!! Effectively, that must be a strange situation to be in. But, at the end of the day, it’s not that important.
I lost my faith in religion, sure, but not in the fact that I exist as a spiritual person.
Interesting comment, that......needs to be thought about..
I never thought of looking at things that way!! Effectively, that must be a strange situation to be in. But, at the end of the day, it’s not that important.
I lost my faith in religion, sure, but not in the fact that I exist as a spiritual person.
Interesting comment, that......needs to be thought about..
(Local Perspectives)
Michael...
Your experience is not uncommon, sadly. My wife is exactly the same..
I met my young American wife when she had just turned 14., 18 days before her 15th birthday, our oldest son was born..Her in the U.S., me in Mexico.
Her parents were devestated as she was just a child herself. Her mother at the time was a very devout Catholic and took my wife to mass various times a week..all was fine at first, March 1987.. At that time, spring was in full bloom, the cold days, heavy sweaters, and woolen coats were laid to rest..along with the welcoming of the then unmarried pregnant girl carrying my child in the Catholic Church..
As her and her Mother entered for Mass, the priest took them to the side, asked her she was married as she was obviously pregnant.. When they both her and her mother answered ”no”.. the priest told her mother not to bring the ”sinner” child to mass again and walked away.
That was the day my wife walked away from the Church, but NOT from God or her believes.. She works in a Catholic school and has found a priest who is more than welcoming..even says Father Simon was the worst type of man, abusing not only her, but all who have faith..She still will not enter.. sometimes she sits outside and listens to a bit of the sermon, but never under the roof of men in robes who want to play God..
Your experience is not uncommon, sadly. My wife is exactly the same..
I met my young American wife when she had just turned 14., 18 days before her 15th birthday, our oldest son was born..Her in the U.S., me in Mexico.
Her parents were devestated as she was just a child herself. Her mother at the time was a very devout Catholic and took my wife to mass various times a week..all was fine at first, March 1987.. At that time, spring was in full bloom, the cold days, heavy sweaters, and woolen coats were laid to rest..along with the welcoming of the then unmarried pregnant girl carrying my child in the Catholic Church..
As her and her Mother entered for Mass, the priest took them to the side, asked her she was married as she was obviously pregnant.. When they both her and her mother answered ”no”.. the priest told her mother not to bring the ”sinner” child to mass again and walked away.
That was the day my wife walked away from the Church, but NOT from God or her believes.. She works in a Catholic school and has found a priest who is more than welcoming..even says Father Simon was the worst type of man, abusing not only her, but all who have faith..She still will not enter.. sometimes she sits outside and listens to a bit of the sermon, but never under the roof of men in robes who want to play God..
(Global Perspectives)
”but never under the roof of men in robes who want to play God..” Amen to that Oscar. Excellently put! And, like your wife, I too have a priest for a friend, (a Jesuit). They are not all bad, it’s just that ”once bitten, twice shy” has become my way of thinking. That must have been a horrible thing for your wife to live.
Maybe they should give priests training courses in human relations?
Good day to you, my friend Oscar, and to your wife and family too. If I was a church, you’d all be welcome. Anytime....
Maybe they should give priests training courses in human relations?
Good day to you, my friend Oscar, and to your wife and family too. If I was a church, you’d all be welcome. Anytime....
(Local Perspectives)
In Urdu we say :-
”Dil me rehti hai tasvir-e-yaar;
Jab zara gardan jhukai dekh lee.”
It means,
His image lives in my heart;
Wheever I bow my neck,(I) see Him.”
Hinduism believes that God is omnipresent. He is in Mary, Jesus, Gods, Goddesses, Idols, Images, Paintings, stones, plants, animals, rivers, sky, air, rays,Visible or Invisible. Its not necessary to enter a temple or Church or any place of worship to pray him. You can pray anywhere; He listens.
”Dil me rehti hai tasvir-e-yaar;
Jab zara gardan jhukai dekh lee.”
It means,
His image lives in my heart;
Wheever I bow my neck,(I) see Him.”
Hinduism believes that God is omnipresent. He is in Mary, Jesus, Gods, Goddesses, Idols, Images, Paintings, stones, plants, animals, rivers, sky, air, rays,Visible or Invisible. Its not necessary to enter a temple or Church or any place of worship to pray him. You can pray anywhere; He listens.
(Global Perspectives)
Thank you Ramesh. I too believe that god is omnipresent, but I haven’t been able to ”concretise” who he is.
I am, however, thanks to you and others like you, getting closer.
It all makes me think (seriously) that I should go live in your part of the world, where (ironically, seeing as religion is omnipresent) you all seem to be so much more philosophically inclined than here in Europe....
I am, however, thanks to you and others like you, getting closer.
It all makes me think (seriously) that I should go live in your part of the world, where (ironically, seeing as religion is omnipresent) you all seem to be so much more philosophically inclined than here in Europe....
(Local Perspectives)
Ramesh,
I’d love to find out more about Hinduism, see if I can extract some truths to carry with me...Where is a good place to begin..something simple..I would basically need something more along the lines of those books on every subject..I need Hinduism for dummies or Hinduism 101...I’ve tried on internet, but most of the more specific sites, are just too specific.
I need a source where I can start from zero...thanks
I’d love to find out more about Hinduism, see if I can extract some truths to carry with me...Where is a good place to begin..something simple..I would basically need something more along the lines of those books on every subject..I need Hinduism for dummies or Hinduism 101...I’ve tried on internet, but most of the more specific sites, are just too specific.
I need a source where I can start from zero...thanks
(Global Perspectives)
folks why bother if god is there or not any way it is ok
we are there & the life is there & universe is there what matters is to be happy & at peace with ourselves
itried to brood over the subject from the childhood meet many holy persons read religious texts
all i know that i have to be a good human being & help others to the best of my capacity or at least not to harm any one if i can
the universe can take care of it self
even a simple formula requires x to solve it ,god is an expression of our acceptance of our ignorance of what we do not know it is a great humbling concept a healer of all wounds
i read some where that the kingdom of god is within us so all of us & the entire universe is god let us excavate within us else it will be a futile search for our shadow
good luck do not worry be happy
i come from bengal where people have a sweet tooth cottage cheese in any form is healthy so is milk or curd or fruits
a beautiful sunrise \sunset , a flower , the smile on a child’s face
so happy god hunting please do let me know once you find him
we are there & the life is there & universe is there what matters is to be happy & at peace with ourselves
itried to brood over the subject from the childhood meet many holy persons read religious texts
all i know that i have to be a good human being & help others to the best of my capacity or at least not to harm any one if i can
the universe can take care of it self
even a simple formula requires x to solve it ,god is an expression of our acceptance of our ignorance of what we do not know it is a great humbling concept a healer of all wounds
i read some where that the kingdom of god is within us so all of us & the entire universe is god let us excavate within us else it will be a futile search for our shadow
good luck do not worry be happy
i come from bengal where people have a sweet tooth cottage cheese in any form is healthy so is milk or curd or fruits
a beautiful sunrise \sunset , a flower , the smile on a child’s face
so happy god hunting please do let me know once you find him
(Global Perspectives)
Thanks Shiv. This is a great postlol! Not because I wrote it, but because YOU, and all the others, have answered it.
There is so much good stuff to read in all your comments.
Your comments in fact, are a super article in themselves.......
There is so much good stuff to read in all your comments.
Your comments in fact, are a super article in themselves.......
(Local Perspectives)
”Look at the sheer beauty running ”violently out of control””.
One of the most beautiful sentences I’ve ever read in english.
And just think! If I had not walked out of that church, I’d never have been lucky enough to read it and understand what you are saying....
Thank you my Friend.
One of the most beautiful sentences I’ve ever read in english.
And just think! If I had not walked out of that church, I’d never have been lucky enough to read it and understand what you are saying....
Thank you my Friend.
(Local Perspectives)
I am finding it difficult to write Michael. There is so much to talk, discuss and share about this post and the earlier one, that we can spend days and days doing just that :)
There are too many ”why’s” in this world that needs an answer.
I don’t feel angry with the priest (and his likes) who was rude to you. I feel angry with GOD who allows such people to stay so close to him (or is GOD a her?).
I had gone to Kedarnath, one of the very holy places for Hindu’s in the Himalayas, and just because my father could pay few hundred Rupees to the priest (officially), we could sit right next to the deity inside the temple and offer prayers, while many hundreds of devotees, most of them poor people, who had also tracked 14 kms to reach the temple up in the cold mountain, were made to stand in a queue and were allowed just a glimpse of the deity before they were literally pushed out of the temple by the temple people who were managing the queue. This happened almost 20 years ago but since then I don’t go to any so called major religious place. I think GOD himself/herself is helpless, so I don’t feel like to bother him/her with my prayers and problems. I will wait till I get to meet him/her personally once I am gone from here for good :)
But, I do believe in a creator. There are just too many compelling evidences that there IS a creator. And I believe our creator has tremendous knowledge of Engineering (just look at the way the bones, muscles, heart, joints etc in our body works) and Chemicals (every emotion is controlled by chemical, reproduction is due to chemical reaction etc etc). And I am not convinced by the answers giving by religions of this world.
And Michael, that priest who told you to go away from the church, those priests in Kedarnath and their likes, if they are close to GOD, I would say GOD save our GODs.
There are too many ”why’s” in this world that needs an answer.
I don’t feel angry with the priest (and his likes) who was rude to you. I feel angry with GOD who allows such people to stay so close to him (or is GOD a her?).
I had gone to Kedarnath, one of the very holy places for Hindu’s in the Himalayas, and just because my father could pay few hundred Rupees to the priest (officially), we could sit right next to the deity inside the temple and offer prayers, while many hundreds of devotees, most of them poor people, who had also tracked 14 kms to reach the temple up in the cold mountain, were made to stand in a queue and were allowed just a glimpse of the deity before they were literally pushed out of the temple by the temple people who were managing the queue. This happened almost 20 years ago but since then I don’t go to any so called major religious place. I think GOD himself/herself is helpless, so I don’t feel like to bother him/her with my prayers and problems. I will wait till I get to meet him/her personally once I am gone from here for good :)
But, I do believe in a creator. There are just too many compelling evidences that there IS a creator. And I believe our creator has tremendous knowledge of Engineering (just look at the way the bones, muscles, heart, joints etc in our body works) and Chemicals (every emotion is controlled by chemical, reproduction is due to chemical reaction etc etc). And I am not convinced by the answers giving by religions of this world.
And Michael, that priest who told you to go away from the church, those priests in Kedarnath and their likes, if they are close to GOD, I would say GOD save our GODs.
(Global Perspectives)
”I think GOD himself/herself is helpless, so I don’t feel like to bother him/her with my prayers and problems. I will wait till I get to meet him/her personally once I am gone from here for good :)”
Right. Absolutely right. And I don’t blame the priest either. Maybe someone stole something from his church that morning and he was still angry about it? Maybe he just got his tax forms to fill in? Maybe he just lost his parents?
I don’t know, and I never will.
What’s important though is to come to terms with what we ”know”. And, as far as that’s concerned, it’s just as difficult as understanding him. We’re just humans. It’s strange that we don’t judge people because it’s ”politically incorrect”, but we do ”judge” religion.
I’ve judged it anyway. All I have to do now is read the things you and the other kind people here have written. It’s worth so much more.......than a kit-form-spiritual-salvation deal.
Thanks for your comment Manish.
(ps. What’s happening in Kedarnath these days...?)
Right. Absolutely right. And I don’t blame the priest either. Maybe someone stole something from his church that morning and he was still angry about it? Maybe he just got his tax forms to fill in? Maybe he just lost his parents?
I don’t know, and I never will.
What’s important though is to come to terms with what we ”know”. And, as far as that’s concerned, it’s just as difficult as understanding him. We’re just humans. It’s strange that we don’t judge people because it’s ”politically incorrect”, but we do ”judge” religion.
I’ve judged it anyway. All I have to do now is read the things you and the other kind people here have written. It’s worth so much more.......than a kit-form-spiritual-salvation deal.
Thanks for your comment Manish.
(ps. What’s happening in Kedarnath these days...?)
(Local Perspectives)
”It’s strange that we don’t judge people because it’s ”politically incorrect”, but we do ”judge” religion.”
I think that’s because now a days we have knowledge and we have started asking questions. If religion cannot help people like you and me, does it really deserve any importance in our lives?
If a child whose world has just collapsed around him is not allowed, of all the people, by the priest, to sit and talk to his GOD, what is this religion nonsense we talk about?
Oh, and it must be business as usual in Kedarnath and all other temples across India... worldly things like market meltdown or recession has no effect on such ’religious’ places :)
I think that’s because now a days we have knowledge and we have started asking questions. If religion cannot help people like you and me, does it really deserve any importance in our lives?
If a child whose world has just collapsed around him is not allowed, of all the people, by the priest, to sit and talk to his GOD, what is this religion nonsense we talk about?
Oh, and it must be business as usual in Kedarnath and all other temples across India... worldly things like market meltdown or recession has no effect on such ’religious’ places :)
(Global Perspectives)
You are asking extremely pertinent questions here. They are also dangerous questions. Dangerous for those who want to maintain this hypocritical status quo, and pertinent because we are the people of this world, and we are, (that’s just the problem for them) quite rightly asking questions.....
(Local Perspectives)
Religions, temples, churches, mosques etc has nothing to do with GOD or the creator. That’s what I feel.
There is a creator who created us all and possibly wrote our destiny (GOD?) and then PEOPLE made religion, temples, churches etc, so that we can have something tangible to fall back on.
However, over a period of time, some people recognized the power or religion and spirituality and started taking advantage. It offers a win-win solution. It gives unlimited power and wealth creating opportunity to people who are in control (priests, religious leaders, religious trusts etc), and for ordinary people, it gives an easy way to wash off their sins, communicate to GOD, ask help for solving their problems etc.
Maybe it all started with good intentions but over a period of time, it fell in wrong hands... But the one who looses in this win-win game are people who ask questions... We don’t get answers that makes sense.
There is a creator who created us all and possibly wrote our destiny (GOD?) and then PEOPLE made religion, temples, churches etc, so that we can have something tangible to fall back on.
However, over a period of time, some people recognized the power or religion and spirituality and started taking advantage. It offers a win-win solution. It gives unlimited power and wealth creating opportunity to people who are in control (priests, religious leaders, religious trusts etc), and for ordinary people, it gives an easy way to wash off their sins, communicate to GOD, ask help for solving their problems etc.
Maybe it all started with good intentions but over a period of time, it fell in wrong hands... But the one who looses in this win-win game are people who ask questions... We don’t get answers that makes sense.
(Global Perspectives)
Manish, I was in a bar in Liverpool years ago, talking about all this to a friend over a few beers. I came up with, spontaneously, my famous ”Table Theory”
It went like this;
”The table a which we are sitting represents the universe/cosmos as we know it. There are millions of light years of it. There are thousands of galaxies. There are hundreds of thousands of solar systems. We are in one of them. It is the size of the tiny pen mark that you see on the table. And, on our little planet (they call it ”Earth”), there are people who actually think they know where this all comes from!!!
And they are even capable of killing each other to prove it!!!!
Talk about arrogance!
(But that doesn’t stop me from living my spiritual life).
I may have been drunk at the time Manish, but I have never forgotten that conversation..............
It went like this;
”The table a which we are sitting represents the universe/cosmos as we know it. There are millions of light years of it. There are thousands of galaxies. There are hundreds of thousands of solar systems. We are in one of them. It is the size of the tiny pen mark that you see on the table. And, on our little planet (they call it ”Earth”), there are people who actually think they know where this all comes from!!!
And they are even capable of killing each other to prove it!!!!
Talk about arrogance!
(But that doesn’t stop me from living my spiritual life).
I may have been drunk at the time Manish, but I have never forgotten that conversation..............
(Local Perspectives)
Fantastic Michael! Congratulations on explaining it so beautifully lol!!! You have put it all in correct perspective.
If we take a top down view of things, we will realize how small, minuscule, microscopic, insignificant we humans are in this universe!
We may have come a long way from stone age apes to flying supersonic jets but when we look down at our place in the universe, we are still microscopic.
But that’s exactly where our questions starts.
Was it a freak accidental mixing of chemicals on our planet combined with favorable conditions that created that single cell from where life originated or did GOD create us in whatever way your religion tells you about origin of life.
Damn, if only we can call god!
If we take a top down view of things, we will realize how small, minuscule, microscopic, insignificant we humans are in this universe!
We may have come a long way from stone age apes to flying supersonic jets but when we look down at our place in the universe, we are still microscopic.
But that’s exactly where our questions starts.
Was it a freak accidental mixing of chemicals on our planet combined with favorable conditions that created that single cell from where life originated or did GOD create us in whatever way your religion tells you about origin of life.
Damn, if only we can call god!
(Global Perspectives)
”If only we can call god”.
You know what? Even if I had his number, I don’t think I would call him. This is MY mission. I need it. I don’t need easy answers......I need MY version.
You know what? Even if I had his number, I don’t think I would call him. This is MY mission. I need it. I don’t need easy answers......I need MY version.
(Local Perspectives)
”Michael, I see some method in this madness but religion is surely does not answer that method to me... and the mission reaches dead end”.
And that, my friend Manish, is precisely why I believe in ”god”, or ”something”, or ”spirituality”, or ”who knows what”, but I don’t believe in religion.
Because MY mission is not to know who god is, (I wouldn’t be so pretentious) but to know who I am myself...........
And that, my friend Manish, is precisely why I believe in ”god”, or ”something”, or ”spirituality”, or ”who knows what”, but I don’t believe in religion.
Because MY mission is not to know who god is, (I wouldn’t be so pretentious) but to know who I am myself...........
(Local Perspectives)
Take a look at this http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/java/scienceopticsu/powersof10/
(Global Perspectives)
”View the Milky Way at 10 million light years from the Earth. Then move through space towards the Earth in successive orders of magnitude until you reach a tall oak tree just outside the buildings of the National High Magnetic Field Laboratory in Tallahassee, Florida. After that, begin to move from the actual size of a leaf into a microscopic world that reveals leaf cell walls, the cell nucleus, chromatin, DNA and finally, into the subatomic universe of electrons and protons”.
And then..........
And then..........
(Local Perspectives)
And then think. Did someone actually create all this? And after creating such immense universe and such immense microscopic world, someone sat down to create humans and then also wrote our individual destinies giving us pain and sorrow and joy and happiness....
Or was this all an accidental creation and our life itself is nothing but series of coincidences... and that there is no such thing as god.
Michael, I see some method in this madness but religion is surely does not answer that method to me... and the mission reaches dead end.
Or was this all an accidental creation and our life itself is nothing but series of coincidences... and that there is no such thing as god.
Michael, I see some method in this madness but religion is surely does not answer that method to me... and the mission reaches dead end.
(Global Perspectives)
I think we place too much importance on WHO did it or WHY..in doing so we stop seeing the beauty of the WHOLE and get stuck on unexplained specifics..
Have you ever been watching a movie and couldn’t tear yourself away only to be disillusioned by the ending? Did you sometimes wish it just could have gone on...and on...or maybe wish it would have stopped midway without that nasty, senseless ending?
Have you ever seen something so naturally beautiful that it left you in awe? literally for a loss of words?
Theses may be silly examples, but they are valid...
Many times when we stay too long and delve too deep whe are disappointed.. We are humans, we were created to rationalize to look for errors and WE WILL FIND THEM, many times at the cost of losing something wonderful..
I saw an oasis in a place called 4 cienegas in Coahuila Mexico...This place is desert..ugly..deserted ..dry and forgotten..somehow in the middle of brush, dirt, and trash a BEAUTIFUL oasis filled with the most crystal blue water and colorful ocean fish ”appeared”. Why is it there? Who put it there..HOW did it get there? Hell if I know and HELL if I care..it’s there..I don’t think I will go again, but I WILL carry it’s memory and search for more OASIS..
Movies and books build our expectations to such a height that regardless of the ending, we are never truley happy...why because we have reached the end of the line...there is NOTHING more to LEARN, SEE, OR THINK ABOUT...
If we overthink our beliefs we will get to a point where we feel the same..having all the answers and knowing all of the formulas disolves our need to know... Do you have any real need for an alegebra problem once you have worked the formula and solved it? or do you forgot about it and move on to the next...
The idea having your search mission for truths allows you to keep working at it...carry the truths you have found and move on to keep gaining pieces of knowledge to a much bigger task...Life..
That is my belief...I don’t want to know...I WANT to KEEP wanting to know, for their I will encounter real TRUTHS and form MY BELIEFS.
Have you ever been watching a movie and couldn’t tear yourself away only to be disillusioned by the ending? Did you sometimes wish it just could have gone on...and on...or maybe wish it would have stopped midway without that nasty, senseless ending?
Have you ever seen something so naturally beautiful that it left you in awe? literally for a loss of words?
Theses may be silly examples, but they are valid...
Many times when we stay too long and delve too deep whe are disappointed.. We are humans, we were created to rationalize to look for errors and WE WILL FIND THEM, many times at the cost of losing something wonderful..
I saw an oasis in a place called 4 cienegas in Coahuila Mexico...This place is desert..ugly..deserted ..dry and forgotten..somehow in the middle of brush, dirt, and trash a BEAUTIFUL oasis filled with the most crystal blue water and colorful ocean fish ”appeared”. Why is it there? Who put it there..HOW did it get there? Hell if I know and HELL if I care..it’s there..I don’t think I will go again, but I WILL carry it’s memory and search for more OASIS..
Movies and books build our expectations to such a height that regardless of the ending, we are never truley happy...why because we have reached the end of the line...there is NOTHING more to LEARN, SEE, OR THINK ABOUT...
If we overthink our beliefs we will get to a point where we feel the same..having all the answers and knowing all of the formulas disolves our need to know... Do you have any real need for an alegebra problem once you have worked the formula and solved it? or do you forgot about it and move on to the next...
The idea having your search mission for truths allows you to keep working at it...carry the truths you have found and move on to keep gaining pieces of knowledge to a much bigger task...Life..
That is my belief...I don’t want to know...I WANT to KEEP wanting to know, for their I will encounter real TRUTHS and form MY BELIEFS.
(Global Perspectives)
Oscar, I think such thoughts of WHO and WHY comes naturally when faced with some serious situation in life.
(Global Perspectives)
the ”thought of who and why” will drive us to search...but if we settle for one
KNOWN we fail...We have to keep searching to double check..adding pieces...
I FEAR KNOWING...what if I KNEW the Catholic church in which I was raised and the belief that MY CATHOLIC CHRIST was the ONLY one..??? When I got to the end of a chapter and found MY GOD FROM MY CHURCH screwing people over like what happened to Michael and my wife..I would be done..GOD SUCKS..without God the world is screwed..why bother with anything we’re all f-cked anyways.
But I DON’T know, therefore I search..Like Michael I search not for God, but for myself, the world and humanity...the masterpiece of ”a” God or higher being...
I think if we all KNEW, there would be no reson for BELIEVING and that ”not knowing” is exactly what allows us to carry on each day, holding on to hope, and searching for pieces of understanding the beauty we still find in such an ugly, nasty place we all call HOME.
they say what you DON’T KNOW WON’T KILL YOU....
KNOWN we fail...We have to keep searching to double check..adding pieces...
I FEAR KNOWING...what if I KNEW the Catholic church in which I was raised and the belief that MY CATHOLIC CHRIST was the ONLY one..??? When I got to the end of a chapter and found MY GOD FROM MY CHURCH screwing people over like what happened to Michael and my wife..I would be done..GOD SUCKS..without God the world is screwed..why bother with anything we’re all f-cked anyways.
But I DON’T know, therefore I search..Like Michael I search not for God, but for myself, the world and humanity...the masterpiece of ”a” God or higher being...
I think if we all KNEW, there would be no reson for BELIEVING and that ”not knowing” is exactly what allows us to carry on each day, holding on to hope, and searching for pieces of understanding the beauty we still find in such an ugly, nasty place we all call HOME.
they say what you DON’T KNOW WON’T KILL YOU....
(Global Perspectives)
”That is my belief...I don’t want to know...I WANT to KEEP wanting to know, for their I will encounter real TRUTHS and form MY BELIEFS”.
That’s the mission.You said here it from the get go. You just said it again. You’re right.
Everything else is the kind of complacency and smug and ignorant self-satisfaction that I can’t afford.......
That’s the mission.You said here it from the get go. You just said it again. You’re right.
Everything else is the kind of complacency and smug and ignorant self-satisfaction that I can’t afford.......
(Local Perspectives)
Good luck to you Michael, sincerely hope you get your answers.
(Global Perspectives)
”What you don’t know can’t kill you?” Dunno Oscar.
I’m either stupid or somethin’ but I ALWAYS want to know....if not I might as well not be here. The day I stop asking questions is the day.....and that day is not going to come.
I’m either stupid or somethin’ but I ALWAYS want to know....if not I might as well not be here. The day I stop asking questions is the day.....and that day is not going to come.
(Local Perspectives)
My point in the quote is ”we don’t know”..realistically we will never know.. therefore we keep searching..
Think of everything we don’t know that has benefitted us in driving us to seek answers, to simply not be ABLE to rest, to never CONFORM to a common beleif, because although pretty factual, we still can’t quite say it’s a fact..A KNOWN FACT...
Think of AIDS. If we said AIDS kills, AIDS is incurable..period.. we would never have found that AIDS doesn’t ALWAYS KILL, thus we would never seek to find a cure...
If we KNEW the exact day we were going to die, would it benfit us? If I KNEW I was going to live to the ripe old age of 94 and my children much longer would I still have the same drive? Would I be quite so concerned about the situation my country is facing? Let’s face it, gotta be honest...if I knew many would die, but none who are close to me, my own were safe and secure by a pre-marked, guarenteed date..etched in stone. Would I be so worried? would I be so insistant on change? Sounds terrible, but it’s true.
Because I DON’T know, I have to keep moving..I have to make the time I have or do not have worthwhile... I have to at least try to make change..I have to let my children know how much I want them, need them and love them EVERYDAY because I DON’T KNOW if I’ll have tomarrow...
Sometimes it is KNOWING that will kill you, because you just don’t have a need to believe in any other..There is NO NEED to search for something you already have.
Think of everything we don’t know that has benefitted us in driving us to seek answers, to simply not be ABLE to rest, to never CONFORM to a common beleif, because although pretty factual, we still can’t quite say it’s a fact..A KNOWN FACT...
Think of AIDS. If we said AIDS kills, AIDS is incurable..period.. we would never have found that AIDS doesn’t ALWAYS KILL, thus we would never seek to find a cure...
If we KNEW the exact day we were going to die, would it benfit us? If I KNEW I was going to live to the ripe old age of 94 and my children much longer would I still have the same drive? Would I be quite so concerned about the situation my country is facing? Let’s face it, gotta be honest...if I knew many would die, but none who are close to me, my own were safe and secure by a pre-marked, guarenteed date..etched in stone. Would I be so worried? would I be so insistant on change? Sounds terrible, but it’s true.
Because I DON’T know, I have to keep moving..I have to make the time I have or do not have worthwhile... I have to at least try to make change..I have to let my children know how much I want them, need them and love them EVERYDAY because I DON’T KNOW if I’ll have tomarrow...
Sometimes it is KNOWING that will kill you, because you just don’t have a need to believe in any other..There is NO NEED to search for something you already have.
(Global Perspectives)
To begin with, I would suggest that you kindly read an English translation of ”Gita”. There are many commentaries, including that of Mahatma Gandhi, Tilak, S. Radhakrishnan and 330 others. You may try the ISKCON version.
I suggest it not from a religious point of view. It is a discourse between Lord Krishna and Arjuna on the battlefield of Kurukshetra in the famous epic Mahabharat about 5000 years ago. If you feel that there was no civilisation during that time, read it as fiction. We Hindus believe that the battle was real. If it was really, real, it was a dirty war. The words spoken are gems of knowledge. To begin with, that is the butter amongst variety of cow-milk.
I suggest it not from a religious point of view. It is a discourse between Lord Krishna and Arjuna on the battlefield of Kurukshetra in the famous epic Mahabharat about 5000 years ago. If you feel that there was no civilisation during that time, read it as fiction. We Hindus believe that the battle was real. If it was really, real, it was a dirty war. The words spoken are gems of knowledge. To begin with, that is the butter amongst variety of cow-milk.
(Global Perspectives)
thank you so much Ramesh...I will definitly seek these books..I figured if I wanted good sources for finding my truths, you would be the man to seek...Never have I been disappointed by your kindness, truths, and enlightment in sharing your ”world”.
(Global Perspectives)
It is my pleasure.
I have written an article on the concept of time in Hinduism. If you wish, have a look. It would give you an idea as to how deep our saints have gone into each aspect and how vast is their knowledge.
I have written an article on the concept of time in Hinduism. If you wish, have a look. It would give you an idea as to how deep our saints have gone into each aspect and how vast is their knowledge.
(Global Perspectives)
First of all,it is good to understand that we are the temple of GOD and therefore by making ourselves clean we will be appeasing God and this takes me to my next point...
many people go to church but it is only afew of the church goers who can tell you what takes them to church,to me going to church has never been the prerequisite of following Gods word,one can just live his/her life away from church but still believe in God and be a better being than the church goer.
many people go to church but it is only afew of the church goers who can tell you what takes them to church,to me going to church has never been the prerequisite of following Gods word,one can just live his/her life away from church but still believe in God and be a better being than the church goer.
(Global Perspectives)
...and you know what you’re talking about. Your article on mini-skirts etc proves it. Thank you for your encouragment Duncan, it’s a pleasure to read this....
(Local Perspectives)
Michael,
”God is there, I know, it’s just that I don’t yet have a communication device like ”prayer” or ”meditation” with which to dialogue. I will find that though. That’s the reason for my existence.......” Spot on!!!!!... the last two sentences i.e.....How amazing that you have been led to this truth!
Like Shahwar stated so beautifully:
...communication...is your call!
The priest turned you away;but ’He’ has communicated.It is for you to now fully communicate with him !
Didn’t ’He’ listen to the prayer in your heart to give you a balm for your soul? So why do you feel:”I don’t yet have a communication device like ”prayer” or ”meditation” with which to dialogue”?
The heart is your prayer device and the soul your means for acting on his will.
Our mind,senses and body are too limited to be able to cope with anything except the immense complexities of the material world.
In any case don’t you think that to communicate with a spiritual being you would need spiritual means?
And yes you will find him-as well as proof of ’Him’ -if you strive enough;for it would be most ungodly of Him to expect someone to believe in Him without providing proof of his existance .But I will leave this thought for you to ponder on your own.
Here I will share with you another poem I wrote when contemplating about God.Shikwa in Urdu means complaint -this is the first part of my poem;and Jawab i Shikwa means ,the answer to the complaint(second part):
Shikwa: Lord why? - Part-I
I curse this day a muse of mine leads me to disaster,
Words sure to get me to the fiery gates that much faster,
’Tis blasphemy this a slave questioning The Master?
Lord if you are one;
Why these three-The Rabbi, The Mullah and The Pastor?
True without a burden the entire world you can feed,
And the prayers of the chosen you always do heed?
Yet an abundance of disease, wants, misery and greed;
Lord if you do care;
Why are your (un)believing children in such a dire need?
Loving you without end we proclaim all glory is thine
Certainly too constantly serve you we all do pine,
While our soul finds joy only in a heavenly shrine.
Lord if this be ‘True’
Oh why then do your believers worship all but you?
To many a nation you sent your holy prophets as guide,
And to some you also the Holy Scriptures did provide,
While you yourself do every-where reside.
Lord if you are ‘The Light’;
Why did I fail to find you though I really tried?
For Moses and Ram to spread thy code a million people die,
And Rome spreads thy sacred verse through murder and through lie,
While Islam that religion of peace all ‘unbelievers’ does decry?
Lord if you are ‘Grace’;
Why are all your ‘Believers’ such a villainous race?
Jawab: The Answer- Part-II
The pen wrote from the heart the mind recoiling from sin,
The Devil was without but The Gracious Lord was within,
A tormented soul sought and redemption was about to begin.
The Lord heard my anguished plea,
And amidst my pouring tears drowned me into a sleep.
He (more then one; an infinite unity) I can never see,
So the universe a reflection of his might was shown me,
Oh the wonder, the power, the munificence of an endless sea.
I saw many creeds each takes a piece to make a false alter,
Then write self serving laws in Gods name to make men falter.
Dreams of Original creations and Divine conceptions,
Of hollow holies and deceitful deceptions.
Of Divine messages denied without exceptions,
Replaced by dreaded divinities with draconian decrees,
- And predatory prophets plying with peoples perceptions.
Of plundering priesthood pocketing their God’s wages,
And scheming sages sinning to sainthood in all the ages,
With God’s helpless children rotting in cages.
Of God’s barbarians sporting cloaks of civilization,
And crusading Caesars starting savage annihilations!
This planet a perfect paradise with all on a plate,
Lost as charity perverted to greed and love to hate,
Yes! Lost as blundering bastards busted our fate.
Now as the sublime slumbers and religion sedates-
Men’s souls are being driven to the devils gate.
But just as I woke I think I heard a voice from within this mayhem cry,
Since time began you have searched for God and do you wonder why,
With all these heartbreaks and frustrations you haven’t given up the try?
The search is for perfection- for a perfect God is he,
And find you will- for who sought a thing that never be?
Tis then I saw the bearded old Sufi from under the tree,
Slowly coming my way holding a shining rosary
I think I heard him murmur as I woke up with a start,
“Seek and you shall find God abides in every loving heart.”
”God is there, I know, it’s just that I don’t yet have a communication device like ”prayer” or ”meditation” with which to dialogue. I will find that though. That’s the reason for my existence.......” Spot on!!!!!... the last two sentences i.e.....How amazing that you have been led to this truth!
Like Shahwar stated so beautifully:
...communication...is your call!
The priest turned you away;but ’He’ has communicated.It is for you to now fully communicate with him !
Didn’t ’He’ listen to the prayer in your heart to give you a balm for your soul? So why do you feel:”I don’t yet have a communication device like ”prayer” or ”meditation” with which to dialogue”?
The heart is your prayer device and the soul your means for acting on his will.
Our mind,senses and body are too limited to be able to cope with anything except the immense complexities of the material world.
In any case don’t you think that to communicate with a spiritual being you would need spiritual means?
And yes you will find him-as well as proof of ’Him’ -if you strive enough;for it would be most ungodly of Him to expect someone to believe in Him without providing proof of his existance .But I will leave this thought for you to ponder on your own.
Here I will share with you another poem I wrote when contemplating about God.Shikwa in Urdu means complaint -this is the first part of my poem;and Jawab i Shikwa means ,the answer to the complaint(second part):
Shikwa: Lord why? - Part-I
I curse this day a muse of mine leads me to disaster,
Words sure to get me to the fiery gates that much faster,
’Tis blasphemy this a slave questioning The Master?
Lord if you are one;
Why these three-The Rabbi, The Mullah and The Pastor?
True without a burden the entire world you can feed,
And the prayers of the chosen you always do heed?
Yet an abundance of disease, wants, misery and greed;
Lord if you do care;
Why are your (un)believing children in such a dire need?
Loving you without end we proclaim all glory is thine
Certainly too constantly serve you we all do pine,
While our soul finds joy only in a heavenly shrine.
Lord if this be ‘True’
Oh why then do your believers worship all but you?
To many a nation you sent your holy prophets as guide,
And to some you also the Holy Scriptures did provide,
While you yourself do every-where reside.
Lord if you are ‘The Light’;
Why did I fail to find you though I really tried?
For Moses and Ram to spread thy code a million people die,
And Rome spreads thy sacred verse through murder and through lie,
While Islam that religion of peace all ‘unbelievers’ does decry?
Lord if you are ‘Grace’;
Why are all your ‘Believers’ such a villainous race?
Jawab: The Answer- Part-II
The pen wrote from the heart the mind recoiling from sin,
The Devil was without but The Gracious Lord was within,
A tormented soul sought and redemption was about to begin.
The Lord heard my anguished plea,
And amidst my pouring tears drowned me into a sleep.
He (more then one; an infinite unity) I can never see,
So the universe a reflection of his might was shown me,
Oh the wonder, the power, the munificence of an endless sea.
I saw many creeds each takes a piece to make a false alter,
Then write self serving laws in Gods name to make men falter.
Dreams of Original creations and Divine conceptions,
Of hollow holies and deceitful deceptions.
Of Divine messages denied without exceptions,
Replaced by dreaded divinities with draconian decrees,
- And predatory prophets plying with peoples perceptions.
Of plundering priesthood pocketing their God’s wages,
And scheming sages sinning to sainthood in all the ages,
With God’s helpless children rotting in cages.
Of God’s barbarians sporting cloaks of civilization,
And crusading Caesars starting savage annihilations!
This planet a perfect paradise with all on a plate,
Lost as charity perverted to greed and love to hate,
Yes! Lost as blundering bastards busted our fate.
Now as the sublime slumbers and religion sedates-
Men’s souls are being driven to the devils gate.
But just as I woke I think I heard a voice from within this mayhem cry,
Since time began you have searched for God and do you wonder why,
With all these heartbreaks and frustrations you haven’t given up the try?
The search is for perfection- for a perfect God is he,
And find you will- for who sought a thing that never be?
Tis then I saw the bearded old Sufi from under the tree,
Slowly coming my way holding a shining rosary
I think I heard him murmur as I woke up with a start,
“Seek and you shall find God abides in every loving heart.”
(Global Perspectives)
Add your Comment
you are a poet of prose!
you have a golden cerebral treasure...a direct proof of GOD!
you have more reason than anyone else to believe in GOD!
i wont argue your faith on the ”mediators”
but do keep faith on GOD!
he’s the one!
and you can’t be a non believer just because you dont visit a church or a mosque, a temple or whatever!
the worship is in you!
believe in this worship!
believe in yourself!
believe in God!
AMEN!